Direction

[Jasper]

After getting blown out by Georgetown last night, it is looking like FU men's lax is in for another long season. In its 5th or 6th season now, the program should be mature enough to be showing real progress and that is not the case. As a matter of fact, the direction appears to be heading south. To say this is disappointing is a major understatement. Our competitor and fellow SoCon member, High Point University started at the same time we did and they hold wins this season over 2 of the top 10 teams in the country - Duke & UVA. That can be done in LAX - small schools can be nationally ranked - Bryant, UMBC, Loyola of Md., Johns Hopkins. etc. come to mind and we are nowhere near competing at that level. Aside from HPU, Richmond and the AF academy from the SoCon have had national recognition. I don't know the solution but I can recognize a problem.

[Affirm]

After getting blown out by Georgetown last night, it is looking like FU men's lax is in for another long season. In its 5th or 6th season now, the program should be mature enough to be showing real progress and that is not the case. As a matter of fact, the direction appears to be heading south. To say this is disappointing is a major understatement. Our competitor and fellow SoCon member, High Point University started at the same time we did and they hold wins this season over 2 of the top 10 teams in the country - Duke & UVA. That can be done in LAX - small schools can be nationally ranked - Bryant, UMBC, Loyola of Md., Johns Hopkins. etc. come to mind and we are nowhere near competing at that level. Aside from HPU, Richmond and the AF academy from the SoCon have had national recognition. I don't know the solution but I can recognize a problem.

Glad we have a great AD who will address this problem appropriately.
And ... I don’t think Johns Hopkins should be called a small school.

[fufanatic]

After getting blown out by Georgetown last night, it is looking like FU men's lax is in for another long season. In its 5th or 6th season now, the program should be mature enough to be showing real progress and that is not the case. As a matter of fact, the direction appears to be heading south. To say this is disappointing is a major understatement. Our competitor and fellow SoCon member, High Point University started at the same time we did and they hold wins this season over 2 of the top 10 teams in the country - Duke & UVA. That can be done in LAX - small schools can be nationally ranked - Bryant, UMBC, Loyola of Md., Johns Hopkins. etc. come to mind and we are nowhere near competing at that level. Aside from HPU, Richmond and the AF academy from the SoCon have had national recognition. I don't know the solution but I can recognize a problem.

I agree. One of the reasons I was one of the few people excited about the addition of men's LAX at Furman was that I thought we had the potential to compete nationally, similar to a women's golf or cross country. But that's clearly not the case for whatever reason. I have cursory knowledge of the sport, but not enough to offer a real opinion on why we haven't been able to accomplish this task, but with the coach we hired, and the smaller schools that have succeeded in the sport, I too thought we could make it happen.

[Jasper]

After getting blown out by Georgetown last night, it is looking like FU men's lax is in for another long season. In its 5th or 6th season now, the program should be mature enough to be showing real progress and that is not the case. As a matter of fact, the direction appears to be heading south. To say this is disappointing is a major understatement. Our competitor and fellow SoCon member, High Point University started at the same time we did and they hold wins this season over 2 of the top 10 teams in the country - Duke & UVA. That can be done in LAX - small schools can be nationally ranked - Bryant, UMBC, Loyola of Md., Johns Hopkins. etc. come to mind and we are nowhere near competing at that level. Aside from HPU, Richmond and the AF academy from the SoCon have had national recognition. I don't know the solution but I can recognize a problem.

Glad we have a great AD who will address this problem appropriately.
And ... I don’t think Johns Hopkins should be called a small school.

Hopkins has about 6000 undergrads and only competes in Div.1 in lacrosse. e.g. football and basketball are non scholarship Div. 3. If you want to call that a big school, that is up to you.

[Fred Garvin]

Time to throw some field turf down on one of their practice fields they don't use and put up about 500 bleacher seats.....feel good sport designed to recruit northern students has failed....get them off the turf at Paladin Stadium....they are like sheep....wearing the turf out

[FU3]

Time to throw some field turf down on one of their practice fields they don't use and put up about 500 bleacher seats.....feel good sport designed to recruit northern students has failed....get them off the turf at Paladin Stadium....they are like sheep....wearing the turf out

I agree with Jasper that the current Furman Lacrosse program is a major disappointment. The turf was bought and paid for as part of the donation to bring in lacrosse, but a smaller turf field would be an asset.. Lacrosse is still the fastest growing HS sport (especially in the SE and West). Furman is going to need to continue to expand its student recruiting base because of the high cost of attendance, LAX fits nicely with that strategy. Should our "feel good" baseball program to recruit rural SE kids be placed on the scrap heap as well ?

[Affirm]

After getting blown out by Georgetown last night, it is looking like FU men's lax is in for another long season. In its 5th or 6th season now, the program should be mature enough to be showing real progress and that is not the case. As a matter of fact, the direction appears to be heading south. To say this is disappointing is a major understatement. Our competitor and fellow SoCon member, High Point University started at the same time we did and they hold wins this season over 2 of the top 10 teams in the country - Duke & UVA. That can be done in LAX - small schools can be nationally ranked - Bryant, UMBC, Loyola of Md., Johns Hopkins. etc. come to mind and we are nowhere near competing at that level. Aside from HPU, Richmond and the AF academy from the SoCon have had national recognition. I don't know the solution but I can recognize a problem.

Glad we have a great AD who will address this problem appropriately.
And ... I don’t think Johns Hopkins should be called a small school.

Hopkins has about 6000 undergrads and only competes in Div.1 in lacrosse. e.g. football and basketball are non scholarship Div. 3. If you want to call that a big school, that is up to you.

Definitely a BIG school in
-academics
-overall reputation
-lacrosse (more success in lacrosse than FU has ever had in ALL sports COMBINED)
-location
So yes, I do want to call Hopkins a big school.
Besides, 6,000 undergrads is more than double FU; and they have professional and graduate schools with many students in addition.

[Paul C]

Just goes to show that throwing big money at an athletic program is no guarantee of success. In fact it’s probably near the bottom.

Wonder if this is Meade’s last year, I think his contract is up this year.

If you look at Furman’s 2016 Form 990 you’ll see his comp was 240k, plus another 30k+ in other comp. at the time it was 32k more than Niko Medved and we all know how that worked out.

Wonder what the market for lacrosse coaches is?

[FUBeAR]

Just goes to show that throwing big money at an athletic program is no guarantee of success. In fact it’s probably near the bottom.

Wonder if this is Meade’s last year, I think his contract is up this year.

If you look at Furman’s 2016 Form 990 you’ll see his comp was 240k, plus another 30k+ in other comp. at the time it was 32k more than Niko Medved and we all know how that worked out.

Wonder what the market for lacrosse coaches is?

Although I personally enjoy watching Lacrosse (sorry Fred, FUBeAR likes what he likes!), this post is not a 'defense' of lax @ FU. Just a question...

Paul - Do you know if that $270k was partially or wholly subsidized by the generous benefactor to the FU LAX program...or nah?

[Jasper]

After getting blown out by Georgetown last night, it is looking like FU men's lax is in for another long season. In its 5th or 6th season now, the program should be mature enough to be showing real progress and that is not the case. As a matter of fact, the direction appears to be heading south. To say this is disappointing is a major understatement. Our competitor and fellow SoCon member, High Point University started at the same time we did and they hold wins this season over 2 of the top 10 teams in the country - Duke & UVA. That can be done in LAX - small schools can be nationally ranked - Bryant, UMBC, Loyola of Md., Johns Hopkins. etc. come to mind and we are nowhere near competing at that level. Aside from HPU, Richmond and the AF academy from the SoCon have had national recognition. I don't know the solution but I can recognize a problem.

Glad we have a great AD who will address this problem appropriately.
And ... I don’t think Johns Hopkins should be called a small school.

Hopkins has about 6000 undergrads and only competes in Div.1 in lacrosse. e.g. football and basketball are non scholarship Div. 3. If you want to call that a big school, that is up to you.

Definitely a BIG school in
-academics
-overall reputation
-lacrosse (more success in lacrosse than FU has ever had in ALL sports COMBINED)
-location
So yes, I do want to call Hopkins a big school.
Besides, 6,000 undergrads is more than double FU; and they have professional and graduate schools with many students in addition.

Then by all mean do so.

[Jasper]

Just goes to show that throwing big money at an athletic program is no guarantee of success. In fact it’s probably near the bottom.

Wonder if this is Meade’s last year, I think his contract is up this year.

If you look at Furman’s 2016 Form 990 you’ll see his comp was 240k, plus another 30k+ in other comp. at the time it was 32k more than Niko Medved and we all know how that worked out.

Wonder what the market for lacrosse coaches is?

Although I personally enjoy watching Lacrosse (sorry Fred, FUBeAR likes what he likes!), this post is not a 'defense' of lax @ FU. Just a question...

Paul - Do you know if that $270k was partially or wholly subsidized by the generous benefactor to the FU LAX program...or nah?

I know a lot of LAX coaches and am told that figure is well above the market. I have no idea if that is subsidized by the benefactor or not but I would guess it is. That kind of money in LAX may be paid by Notre Dame, Denver, UVA and Duke. In other words, the perennial championship contenders. That certainly has not worked. LAX is a fast changing sport with a lot of young coaches with new ideas. Like the Bear says, it is a fun game to watch and it should have caught on much better at FU than it has, IMO. And it lends itself to Furman academic standards from a recruiting standpoint. Lots of kids from prep schools and really good public school districts. Maybe a new, young face is the answer and should be tried before the sport is termed a failure.

[Fred Garvin]

Time to throw some field turf down on one of their practice fields they don't use and put up about 500 bleacher seats.....feel good sport designed to recruit northern students has failed....get them off the turf at Paladin Stadium....they are like sheep....wearing the turf out

I agree with Jasper that the current Furman Lacrosse program is a major disappointment. The turf was bought and paid for as part of the donation to bring in lacrosse, but a smaller turf field would be an asset.. Lacrosse is still the fastest growing HS sport (especially in the SE and West). Furman is going to need to continue to expand its student recruiting base because of the high cost of attendance, LAX fits nicely with that strategy. Should our "feel good" baseball program to recruit rural SE kids be placed on the scrap heap as well ?

A few notes....
1. Baseball at Furman is not a feel good sport but rather an original sport. The mascot of the baseball team was the Hornets before the Paladin mascot was chosen as the one official mascot.
2. The baseball field is one of the original building projects of the new campus. BTW, the campuses used to be downtown.
3. Baseball has always been money deficient at Furman. I know of one former booster(now dead) who wanted to make a nice contribution to the baseball program but was told the contribution would only be used to retire debt.
4. A large amount of the money needed to build the Pierce Horton Complex was actually raised by the lettermen that put all of those championship dates on the field house where lacrosse plays .......and practices because the new fields built for them aren't good enough.

Bottom line is that many of the other programs at Furman have been successful despite frugal spending. Lacrosse got the keys to the Mercedes from day 1 and you have crashed it in a wreck of Danica Patrick proportions. Find some money and throw some turf on the fields that were built for you. Purchase a few hundred bleacher seats or maybe borrow the ones from the band.

[paladinfan12]

I may not know what I am talking about, but I feel like baseball tends to have more upper class suburban families than football, soccer, track, basketball, and other sports. Baseball certainly does not have as many upper class families as lacrosse, but I don't think the sport is constantly deficient for kids who can get in and afford Furman.

[FU3]

Time to throw some field turf down on one of their practice fields they don't use and put up about 500 bleacher seats.....feel good sport designed to recruit northern students has failed....get them off the turf at Paladin Stadium....they are like sheep....wearing the turf out

I agree with Jasper that the current Furman Lacrosse program is a major disappointment. The turf was bought and paid for as part of the donation to bring in lacrosse, but a smaller turf field would be an asset.. Lacrosse is still the fastest growing HS sport (especially in the SE and West). Furman is going to need to continue to expand its student recruiting base because of the high cost of attendance, LAX fits nicely with that strategy. Should our "feel good" baseball program to recruit rural SE kids be placed on the scrap heap as well ?

A few notes....
1. Baseball at Furman is not a feel good sport but rather an original sport. The mascot of the baseball team was the Hornets before the Paladin mascot was chosen as the one official mascot.
2. The baseball field is one of the original building projects of the new campus. BTW, the campuses used to be downtown.
3. Baseball has always been money deficient at Furman. I know of one former booster(now dead) who wanted to make a nice contribution to the baseball program but was told the contribution would only be used to retire debt.
4. A large amount of the money needed to build the Pierce Horton Complex was actually raised by the lettermen that put all of those championship dates on the field house where lacrosse plays .......and practices because the new fields built for them aren't good enough.

Bottom line is that many of the other programs at Furman have been successful despite frugal spending. Lacrosse got the keys to the Mercedes from day 1 and you have crashed it in a wreck of Danica Patrick proportions. Find some money and throw some turf on the fields that were built for you. Purchase a few hundred bleacher seats or maybe borrow the ones from the band.

Lacrosse was given the keys to a Mercedes because a donor gave several million dollars to Furman for that purpose. By your rationale Furman should have turned it down because Baseball was under funded. Your protests aside the field you are so rightly proud of was paid for by said donor and our football team has been the beneficiary of it. The several million dollars spent on the Baseball field house seem to have had little effect on a program that has been (charitably)mediocre at best. Lacrosse at Furman can be successful but as a previous poster pointed out money is no guarantee.

[Jasper]

Facts and logic are not going to carry this argument. I couldn't even get a response past the censors. Very good effort though. I wonder who the "you" is that is referenced in causing the "crash" ? Could be part of the "they" crowd as well.