• Who ya got? 2 FCS Head-to-Head Match-ups this Saturday!

 #31988  by The Jackal
 Tue Sep 29, 2020 11:05 am
FUBeAR wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:41 am
The Jackal wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:04 am
It's hard to see where the DT is lined up. Usually on the triple I would expect he would be unblocked and be the first read. I'll give the RT a pass because it looks like he was slanting/pinching inside. I would think that ordinarily you wouldn't block that man if you were still running the give.

I cannot imagine a scenario, though, where both the overloaded RT and A back would both avoid the OLB. Even if he makes the pitch, that dude is going to blow up the play 5 yards in the backfield.
Nope...OT leaves that guy unblocked ONLY if he can release inside him - otherwise he can blow up the play at the mesh point & cause a fumble. He’s definitely in a 4i and stemming inside. His problem here is technique. He doesn’t get off quick enough at snap & he raises up. His 1st step is OK, but he didn’t keep his chest down on his knee, so his hat doesn’t get across & he has to get back down to attack the DLman low enough. He gets no “pass” from FUBeAR - that’s a clear 1 (did the right thing, but failed to execute).

Also the OverOT & the A-Back are doing the right things...ArcBlock to Safety & Kicking Contain CB.

The RG is the biggest problem. He should have folded around the OT to give him an angle on the p/s LB or he and the OT need to be Combo’ing on the DLman/LB with the OG taking over the DLman & the OT stepping out on the p/ LB. Personally, I like to fold it, but the OLman have to be quick & athletic to do that effectively - so an OT/OG Combo probably would have been best in this case. Regardless you gotta get something on that p/s LB, who’s coming over the top.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but guess I probably need to make it clear who I am talking about.

I think option-niks call this formation "heavy," specifically here, "heavy right." An OT flips to the right side of the formation and a TE/WR is on the line to the left.

Playside DT slants inside. RT has to take him. Read is to pull the give to the B-Back.

OLB/DE (#33) is left unblocked. He attacks the QB and Rainey correctly attempts to pitch it. He fumbles it, but has the right idea.

The guy I'm focused on is the Mike (MLB), #28. We know there's a WR to the play side somewhere. We know there are two safeties back there somewhere. Both the Heavy OT and the WB run right by #28.

It looks like for a second that the heavy OT (#78) might step to him. He has his eyes on the safety and then stutter steps to the LB before staying on the path forward. There does not appear to be a crack block by the WR.

On that play design, I just don't see how you can't block #28. Maybe the RG should have gotten there, but that seems like an incredibly difficult block for him.

Interestingly, I went back and watched the Army/Michigan highlights from last season. Army runs this formation a bunch. What's interesting though, is they never appeared to run this play from that formation. Most every time they are in this formation is it a zone dive (to fullback), load option, rocket toss, or some sort of trap (belly or what they call "down G").

Blocking appears to have gotten messed up, but it's sort of an odd call on a 3rd and 1. You can see the fullback has the first down even without the ball.
 #31994  by FUBeAR
 Tue Sep 29, 2020 1:04 pm
The Jackal wrote:
Tue Sep 29, 2020 11:05 am
FUBeAR wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:41 am
The Jackal wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 11:04 am
It's hard to see where the DT is lined up. Usually on the triple I would expect he would be unblocked and be the first read. I'll give the RT a pass because it looks like he was slanting/pinching inside. I would think that ordinarily you wouldn't block that man if you were still running the give.

I cannot imagine a scenario, though, where both the overloaded RT and A back would both avoid the OLB. Even if he makes the pitch, that dude is going to blow up the play 5 yards in the backfield.
Nope...OT leaves that guy unblocked ONLY if he can release inside him - otherwise he can blow up the play at the mesh point & cause a fumble. He’s definitely in a 4i and stemming inside. His problem here is technique. He doesn’t get off quick enough at snap & he raises up. His 1st step is OK, but he didn’t keep his chest down on his knee, so his hat doesn’t get across & he has to get back down to attack the DLman low enough. He gets no “pass” from FUBeAR - that’s a clear 1 (did the right thing, but failed to execute).

Also the OverOT & the A-Back are doing the right things...ArcBlock to Safety & Kicking Contain CB.

The RG is the biggest problem. He should have folded around the OT to give him an angle on the p/s LB or he and the OT need to be Combo’ing on the DLman/LB with the OG taking over the DLman & the OT stepping out on the p/ LB. Personally, I like to fold it, but the OLman have to be quick & athletic to do that effectively - so an OT/OG Combo probably would have been best in this case. Regardless you gotta get something on that p/s LB, who’s coming over the top.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but guess I probably need to make it clear who I am talking about.

I think option-niks call this formation "heavy," specifically here, "heavy right." An OT flips to the right side of the formation and a TE/WR is on the line to the left. - Sure - really just an OT lining up in TE slot...still have 6 tight on LOS, 4 Backs & 1 WR

Playside DT slants inside. RT has to take him. Yep...or could combo with OG

Read is to pull the give to the B-Back. Not necessarily. Could be auto-adjust or call @ line based on DLman’s alignment, for B-Back & QB to adjust their angle/mesh point to B-Gap (instead of A-Gap) & IF OT gets his head in front, he can wash the DL down & mesh happens off his tail with QB 1st read /dive read being the DE that smacked him. If DE doesn’t close, give & pop for 3+ with B-Back 1-on-1 with LB, who might be stepping outside, or with AGILE OL play could be blocked by p/s OG quick-folding behind OT’s down/wash block

OLB/DE (#33) is left unblocked. He attacks the QB and Rainey correctly attempts to pitch it. He fumbles it, but has the right idea. Yeah since they made none of the adjustments, reads, or OL schemes FUBeAR cites above, this is his 2nd / pitch read & he makes the right decision.

The guy I'm focused on is the Mike (MLB), #28. I would say #28 is SAM, #44 is MIKE, and #45 (walked up on end of line b/s) is WILL

We know there's a WR to the play side somewhere. Yep - you can see him out there at the beginning of the clip. Most likely he is on the LOS & that b/s OT would be eligible if he had the right number on his jersey

We know there are two safeties back there somewhere. Yep - the OT playing TE blocks the b/s Safety, the p/s A-Back blocks the p/s and the WR ‘runs off the p/s CB

Both the Heavy OT and the WB run right by #28. Yep...as they are supposed to do. See above

It looks like for a second that the heavy OT (#78) might step to him. He has his eyes on the safety and then stutter steps to the LB before staying on the path forward. There does not appear to be a crack block by the WR. Nah - OT playing TE is all Safety. He ain’t studyin’ that LB.

On that play design, I just don't see how you can't block #28. Maybe the RG should have gotten there, but that seems like an incredibly difficult block for him. Triple option leaves 2 guys unblocked at points of attack x that’s the beauty of it & how it gives out-manned Teams some measure of equalization. On this play, the 2 guys designed to be unblocked are the DE & the LB...but they could have blocked the LB with a fold by the p/s OG, which would make it really a Load Option. But they stayed with ‘standard rules’ and p/s OG pinches NG to ‘help’ C & goes to b/s LB (bit misses him).

Problems are
1) no adjustment of path/mesh due to DL alignment
2) p/s OT not getting his head in front to stop penetration AND not washing DLman flat down the line
3) 1 & 2 affected 3...which is QB mishandling ball because he didn’t really have a dive read, thus pitch read ca,e too early, and essentially was made off wrong man.


Interestingly, I went back and watched the Army/Michigan highlights from last season. Army runs this formation a bunch. What's interesting though, is they never appeared to run this play from that formation. Most every time they are in this formation is it a zone dive (to fullback), load option, rocket toss, or some sort of trap (belly or what they call "down G"). Army runs the real triple option. Bellhops are running a Rec Ball bastardization of it.

Blocking appears to have gotten messed up, but it's sort of an odd call on a 3rd and 1. You can see the fullback has the first down even without the ball.
see bold comments
 #32003  by The Jackal
 Tue Sep 29, 2020 3:55 pm
I appreciate the insight. I guess I just don't like the entire set up. I don't see how you leave 28 unblocked and does anything other than blow up the pitch man in the alley.

Of course, I hate the whole play design to begin with. You need a yard. EKU has only 8 in the box. Slam the ball up there.

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