What do you think?

[Roundball]

I was making the point that Furman is winning even though their players aren’t all that talented. OK I’m wrong they are awesome. But somehow they needed a miracle to beat the most unathletic group of stiffs I think I’ve ever seen on a college court. So that means the coach must be horrible. What other explanation is there?

You are becoming an “oid” in my rear end.

[Furmanoid]

Youwouldknow, you spend the first half of your post saying anybody can beat anybody. Then you say it would be impossible for Furman to beat number 60 if they weren’t really, really good. Don’t you see that you are contradicting yourself?

I never said Furman didn’t have talent. I said their results were incredibly good considering the talent they have. I think there is huge room for improvement. I guess you don’t. So while I think we can reach a dominant position in the SoCon, I guess you think we’ve just about peaked. I think you are wrong but I won’t call you any names because I’m a grownup.

[DungeonRealm]

Youwouldknow, you spend the first half of your post saying anybody can beat anybody. Then you say it would be impossible for Furman to beat number 60 if they weren’t really, really good. Don’t you see that you are contradicting yourself?

I never said Furman didn’t have talent. I said their results were incredibly good considering the talent they have. I think there is huge room for improvement. I guess you don’t. So while I think we can reach a dominant position in the SoCon, I guess you think we’ve just about peaked. I think you are wrong but I won’t call you any names because I’m a grownup.

You watch a lot of DII hoops but not a lot of Furman games, and you claim to be a Furman fan? How is that possible?
I am guessing you think a good DII team would steamroll through the SoCon, you're probably the only person on this board who would even remotely think that way so don't be surprised to get some serious flack for it

[apaladin]

Mighty Clempson has much more talent than FU as evidenced by their 44 points against an awful Wake team last night. Basketball is a different animal. Any team can look great if the shots are going in and awful the next game if they don’t fall. Consistency is what you want in basketball, keep the bad games at a minimum.

[DungeonRealm]

Its been posted here before, but here are FU win totals each year for the past 8 years

2013 7 wins
2014 9 wins
2015 11 wins
2016 19 wins
2017 23 wins
2018 23 wins
2019 25 wins
2020 18 wins with a minimum of 9 games left

I've watched almost every single game all 8 years as I am sure most of you have. I would say by my eye test our talent level has been steadily rising every single year no doubt about it, and the results prove it as well.

[FurmAlum]

Furmanoid, those are some of the most idiotic comments I have read since I've been on this board. Not all that talented? How could a team go toe to toe with Auburn, at Auburn, with the Refs against us, and almost beat them, with no talent? How could a team go 8-2 thru 10 games in a tough SoCon with no talent? I dare say Lyons, Gurley, Mounce, and Bothwell are 4 of the most talented players we have ever had. FU would beat every team in D2 except 1 or 2 by 30 or more points, and we would beat all of them. You need to watch more Paladin games and a few less D2 games and you would see what we are talking about. Why do you think Clempson and USC won't play us? Because they don't want to get their ass beat, that's why!

[DungeonRealm]

I know we used the Big South Conference as somewhat of a measuring stick for ourselves in years past, kinda have moved on to bigger things but just going back to those metrics we handily beat Winthrop this year (lead them big for most of the game) and they are now 10-0 in Big South play (have the look of a team that could sweep that league).
We don't gauge ourselves or league by the Big South as much anymore but that's just a small sample of the growth we have made at FU and in the SoCon as a whole.

[Furmanoid]

I’ll make a last attempt to defend myself. My DII reference was with respect to an eye test. That is not the same thing as computer rankings. It refers to what you SEE when you watch them. Their size and depth is good DII level. All but once when I’ve watched them they were having off shooting nights so even though their 3 percentage is only 2 or 3 points lower than the DII in my town, it LOOKED to be much worse. They seem to throw the ball away a good bit. Visually there isn’t anything that blows you away- except the win column. You guys are always saying they come in unprepared or don’t play hard, don’t have their hair on fire, etc. Or you offer the coach all kinds of strategic advice when they don’t play well. I think they are giving it their all and are overachieving.

No I didn’t say a top DII would steamroll the SoCon. But to think somebody like NWMS wouldn’t be pretty competitive is just stupid. And no Furman wouldn’t beat every DII by thirty. We’ve beaten 2 not so great ones by less than 30 this year. Oh, and I guess it’s a terrible thing to go and watch your local college if you didn’t go there. How the freak are you ever going to have crowds at FU games without people doing just that?

[PaladinPower]

I’ll make a last attempt to defend myself. My DII reference was with respect to an eye test. That is not the same thing as computer rankings. It refers to what you SEE when you watch them. Their size and depth is good DII level. All but once when I’ve watched them they were having off shooting nights so even though their 3 percentage is only 2 or 3 points lower than the DII in my town, it LOOKED to be much worse. They seem to throw the ball away a good bit. Visually there isn’t anything that blows you away- except the win column. You guys are always saying they come in unprepared or don’t play hard, don’t have their hair on fire, etc. Or you offer the coach all kinds of strategic advice when they don’t play well. I think they are giving it their all and are overachieving.

No I didn’t say a top DII would steamroll the SoCon. But to think somebody like NWMS wouldn’t be pretty competitive is just stupid. And no Furman wouldn’t beat every DII by thirty. We’ve beaten 2 not so great ones by less than 30 this year. Oh, and I guess it’s a terrible thing to go and watch your local college if you didn’t go there. How the freak are you ever going to have crowds at FU games without people doing just that?

Furman actually ranks 27th in all of D1 in Assist/Turnover ratio. They also rank 50th in turnovers per game. These are actual stats, not the eye test.

[MNORM]

I was making the point that Furman is winning even though their players aren’t all that talented. OK I’m wrong they are awesome. But somehow they needed a miracle to beat the most unathletic group of stiffs I think I’ve ever seen on a college court. So that means the coach must be horrible. What other explanation is there?

You should probably get the ESPN+ package and watch more Furman basketball before making such an asinine comment.

[youwouldno]

I’ll make a last attempt to defend myself. My DII reference was with respect to an eye test. That is not the same thing as computer rankings. It refers to what you SEE when you watch them. Their size and depth is good DII level. All but once when I’ve watched them they were having off shooting nights so even though their 3 percentage is only 2 or 3 points lower than the DII in my town, it LOOKED to be much worse. They seem to throw the ball away a good bit. Visually there isn’t anything that blows you away- except the win column. You guys are always saying they come in unprepared or don’t play hard, don’t have their hair on fire, etc. Or you offer the coach all kinds of strategic advice when they don’t play well. I think they are giving it their all and are overachieving.

No I didn’t say a top DII would steamroll the SoCon. But to think somebody like NWMS wouldn’t be pretty competitive is just stupid. And no Furman wouldn’t beat every DII by thirty. We’ve beaten 2 not so great ones by less than 30 this year. Oh, and I guess it’s a terrible thing to go and watch your local college if you didn’t go there. How the freak are you ever going to have crowds at FU games without people doing just that?

The problem with the "eye" test is that some people, such as yourself, have really bad eyes.

NWMS would be average at best in the SoCon despite being 20-1 and 3rd highest rated in D-II.

The simple fact is that Furman is more talented than any D-II team. It's not close. Furman plays vastly better competition than any D-II team - even the SoCon's worst teams would be highly competitive at the D-II level.

And just to be clear - there's aren't opinions. These are mathematical facts. When your "eye" test disagrees with mathematical facts (e.g., turnover rate), you should probably try to think differently about what you're seeing.

[fufanatic]

Imagine watching Gurley, Mounce, Lyons and Bothwell especially and thinking that they "aren't that talented." Yikes. Might be the most insane comments I've ever seen on this board.

[DungeonRealm]

I’ll make a last attempt to defend myself. My DII reference was with respect to an eye test. That is not the same thing as computer rankings. It refers to what you SEE when you watch them. Their size and depth is good DII level. All but once when I’ve watched them they were having off shooting nights so even though their 3 percentage is only 2 or 3 points lower than the DII in my town, it LOOKED to be much worse. They seem to throw the ball away a good bit. Visually there isn’t anything that blows you away- except the win column. You guys are always saying they come in unprepared or don’t play hard, don’t have their hair on fire, etc. Or you offer the coach all kinds of strategic advice when they don’t play well. I think they are giving it their all and are overachieving.

No I didn’t say a top DII would steamroll the SoCon. But to think somebody like NWMS wouldn’t be pretty competitive is just stupid. And no Furman wouldn’t beat every DII by thirty. We’ve beaten 2 not so great ones by less than 30 this year. Oh, and I guess it’s a terrible thing to go and watch your local college if you didn’t go there. How the freak are you ever going to have crowds at FU games without people doing just that?

The eye test says you're watching DII teams play other DII teams against each other, do you realize how idiotic that is? You can't compare that, show me a DII team that can hang with a Top #15 DI team this year, do you have any proof?

We beat down ETSU this year as well, a team that dominated LSU which is now 8-0 in the SEC, show me proof of a DII team capable of those feats this year

[DungeonRealm]

I know we used the Big South Conference as somewhat of a measuring stick for ourselves in years past, kinda have moved on to bigger things but just going back to those metrics we handily beat Winthrop this year (lead them big for most of the game) and they are now 10-0 in Big South play (have the look of a team that could sweep that league).
We don't gauge ourselves or league by the Big South as much anymore but that's just a small sample of the growth we have made at FU and in the SoCon as a whole.

Speaking of, kinda funny to see Winthrop getting a vote in the AP Top 25 today
https://apnews.com/APTop25CollegeBasketballPoll

[CharlieFU]

Not sure what to say about all this.

I will start with TALENT. We have more than we have had in the past, and it has steadily improved over the last 7 years. The stats tell me that and my EYES tell me that. Just cannot be disputed.

Under or overachieved this year? Given the inconsistency of several players and the fact we are essentially a 7 player rotation, I would say slightly overachieved. We are more or less where I thought we might be...despite not developing in some areas as well as I thought we might. We still have a high ceiling with this team.

Here is the crazy thing; I think we have a good chance to be BETTER next year than we are this year. We ought to be better with Noah and Slawson and Bothwell being juniors!

So lets beat Mercer this week, and keep this thing going. We need more butts in the seats, especially students.