State of the football program

[Paul C]

I feel really good about where we are. If you look at all the Fr and Sophs that are making plays and how much talented youth we have, I think we are coming out of this transitional period ready to compete.

[The Jackal]

I feel really good about where we are. If you look at all the Fr and Sophs that are making plays and how much talented youth we have, I think we are coming out of this transitional period ready to compete.

That's where I am.

We cannot create a Payton Award candidate overnight at QB. All we can do now is try to build one.

I've been impressed with Wilson. He looked really good for much of the game against a very strong ETSU defense. Most of Furman's offense is returning, and I think we'll see him continue to develop over time and improve.

I think Vaughn, at this point, has demonstrated he has the ability to "reload" instead of "rebuild" on defense. We're going to lose some key pieces. So does everyone. What he's built on defense, though, is a deep unit that looks like it will continue to return a strong core every season.

[Furmanoid]

I feel really good about where we are. If you look at all the Fr and Sophs that are making plays and how much talented youth we have, I think we are coming out of this transitional period ready to compete.

In college sports aren’t you always in a transitional period? It’s not like we’ve changed coaches or anything. I see us staying pretty much like we are, which isn’t really bad, but not super exciting either. But maybe the status quo will be good enough. I can’t tell if the bad SoCon teams are getting better or if the good teams are getting worse. If we just hang around while everybody else falls apart, we can eventually dominate!

[Davemeister]

I feel really good about where we are. If you look at all the Fr and Sophs that are making plays and how much talented youth we have, I think we are coming out of this transitional period ready to compete.

Think so. Also think we can win NOW.

[The Jackal]

I feel really good about where we are. If you look at all the Fr and Sophs that are making plays and how much talented youth we have, I think we are coming out of this transitional period ready to compete.

In college sports aren’t you always in a transitional period? It’s not like we’ve changed coaches or anything. I see us staying pretty much like we are, which isn’t really bad, but not super exciting either. But maybe the status quo will be good enough. I can’t tell if the bad SoCon teams are getting better or if the good teams are getting worse. If we just hang around while everybody else falls apart, we can eventually dominate!

Not to put too fine a point on it, but that ETSU beat the snot out of an SEC squad. Not a good SEC squad, but similar to what Furman did against UNC once upon a time.

We won't know how good ETSU is until they hit the post season. If they can make a run, maybe we change our evaluation. If they lose in the first round to Kumquat State, then maybe that tells us we aren't that far along.

[The Jackal]

I feel really good about where we are. If you look at all the Fr and Sophs that are making plays and how much talented youth we have, I think we are coming out of this transitional period ready to compete.

Think so. Also think we can win NOW.

No question about that.

[Furmanoid]

I feel really good about where we are. If you look at all the Fr and Sophs that are making plays and how much talented youth we have, I think we are coming out of this transitional period ready to compete.

In college sports aren’t you always in a transitional period? It’s not like we’ve changed coaches or anything. I see us staying pretty much like we are, which isn’t really bad, but not super exciting either. But maybe the status quo will be good enough. I can’t tell if the bad SoCon teams are getting better or if the good teams are getting worse. If we just hang around while everybody else falls apart, we can eventually dominate!

Not to put too fine a point on it, but that ETSU beat the snot out of an SEC squad. Not a good SEC squad, but similar to what Furman did against UNC once upon a time.

We won't know how good ETSU is until they hit the post season. If they can make a run, maybe we change our evaluation. If they lose in the first round to Kumquat State, then maybe that tells us we aren't that far along.

Fair enough. The Vanderbilt thing is hard to analyze because they are so, so bad. But the UTC - UK game also argues for a good SoCon. But on the other hand we’ve got VMI doing well in the conference, and I’m sorry but I just can’t accept that VMI is all of a sudden good. Who wants to go there? It’s the Citadel with no beach and no CofC girls.

Like you say, we may get more clarity in a few weeks. But hey, I’m all for a deteriorating conference if that’s what it takes to win. I just hate that it’s been deteriorating for many years and we still aren’t winning it yet.

[FUBeAR]

I feel really good about where we are. If you look at all the Fr and Sophs that are making plays and how much talented youth we have, I think we are coming out of this transitional period ready to compete.

In college sports aren’t you always in a transitional period? It’s not like we’ve changed coaches or anything. I see us staying pretty much like we are, which isn’t really bad, but not super exciting either. But maybe the status quo will be good enough. I can’t tell if the bad SoCon teams are getting better or if the good teams are getting worse. If we just hang around while everybody else falls apart, we can eventually dominate!

Not to put too fine a point on it, but that ETSU beat the snot out of an SEC squad. Not a good SEC squad, but similar to what Furman did against UNC once upon a time.

We won't know how good ETSU is until they hit the post season. If they can make a run, maybe we change our evaluation. If they lose in the first round to Kumquat State, then maybe that tells us we aren't that far along.

Fair enough. The Vanderbilt thing is hard to analyze because they are so, so bad. But the UTC - UK game also argues for a good SoCon. But on the other hand we’ve got VMI doing well in the conference, and I’m sorry but I just can’t accept that VMI is all of a sudden good. Who wants to go there? It’s the Citadel with no beach and no CofC girls.

Like you say, we may get more clarity in a few weeks. But hey, I’m all for a deteriorating conference if that’s what it takes to win. I just hate that it’s been deteriorating for many years and we still aren’t winning it yet.

VMI is a good Football Team. They also have beautiful mountains and have 929 W&L girls locally (there are only 1477 male Keydets), and can import coeds from nearby Redford, Southern VA Univ., and VaTech.

Unlike the bellhops, the Keydets don’t run an extremely dumbed-down version of an unfashionable, somewhat ‘gimmicky’ Offense. Unlike Samford, the Keydets don’t run a fashionable, somewhat ‘gimmicky’ Offense in a way that magnifies their weaknesses & creates/enhances weaknesses on the other side of the ball. VMI has O-Linemen who can, do, and want to run block. They have size, speed, and depth at the RB position. VMI can play fast, up-tempo Football, but they don’t rely on that ‘gimmick’ for their competitive advantage. They can throw it around & they can run the ball very effectively. They also have a talented & deep corps of Wide Retrievers & TE’s.

Unlike most Teams, VMI lost 6 Starters off their Spring D. So, they’ve taken some time to rebuild on that side of the ball. They gave up too many points in Game 1 vs. Davidson & looked putrid on D vs. Kent State. Still not nearly as good on D as they were last Spring (except against Mercer, but there was more to that story), but they are OK. They kinda got ‘caught’ early against CIT in the same way they ‘caught’ Mercer, but have been consistent otherwise.

All that said…VMI can certainly be beat & could very well lose all 4 of their remaining games. They have Samford at home, but I think we all know that if Sammy comes out hot and/or VMI makes some early mistakes on O, the bullpups, possibly, could get far enough ahead for their porous D to hang on. Not likely, but possible. ETSU has the home game and we know they are talented enough on both sides of the ball to run over the Keydet D & capitalize on a VMI QB that is good, but not as accurate and a bit more mistake-prone than his predecessor. No doubt than Furman’s D can dominate the Roos in Paladin Stadium & the FU O is good enough, especially with a more exp’d (by then) FR QB. Finally, WCU is getting well, they are buying into their new Coaching Staff’s ‘way,’ their back-up QB (playing for their injured starter) is raw, but has a very high ceiling, their (many) D2 transfers are adjusting to the ‘speed of the D1 game,’ and VMI has struggled with the Catamounts in the past.

Honestly, in FUBeAR’s opinion, any SoCon Team, right now, with the exceptions of Woffy & CIT, can beat any other SoCon Team. We have 5 good / playoff-worthy Teams (FU, Mercer, Chatt, ETSU, and VMI), 2 ‘swing’ Teams (pretty good & dangerous, but not Playoff worthy) (Samford (falling) & WCU (rising)), and 2 stragglers (Woffy & CIT - with CIT being a semi-dangerous straggler).

Those top 5 Teams make the SoCon as good as and deeper than it has been in quite a while. As we saw with VMI’s scare of JMU last spring, any of those 5 Teams would be competitive in the Playoffs. Highly confident, they all COULD win a 1st round game, but we know the 2nd round match-ups would not/will not be favorable. Biased (toward Big Sky, MVFC, and (to a lesser extent) CAA Teams) seeding and regionalization now stack the deck against any/all SoCon Teams in Round 2…gotta pull those difficultly-stacked upsets in Round 2 (and win OOC regular season) games to ever hope to unstack the deck.

[Furmanoid]

OK if “highly competitive in the playoffs” = “COULD win a first round game”, then the SoCon is definitely highly competitive in the playoffs. As long as FU doesn’t go backwards I think we end up back on top of this league in a couple more years. And actually I expect football as a whole to get worse and worse so we end up on top of the FCS if we can just maintain the status quo.

[FUBeAR]

OK if “highly competitive in the playoffs” = “COULD win a first round game”, then the SoCon is definitely highly competitive in the playoffs. As long as FU doesn’t go backwards I think we end up back on top of this league in a couple more years. And actually I expect football as a whole to get worse and worse so we end up on top of the FCS if we can just maintain the status quo.

It is…because of the ‘stacked deck’ & regionalization. Win a 1st round game now and we’re always playing on the road. Even undefeated with an SEC win, ETSU was never ranked in the Top 10 & not in any ‘conversations’ about getting a seed…Instead, Big Sky Teams, with 2-4 records, whose only wins were over Teams combining for 1-11 record with that 1 win over a non-schollie program, were holding those rankings, being included in those convo’s. Look at transitional Dixie State’s record this year…They are 0-7, while padding the resumes of contenders for seeds from the Big Sky & the MVFC… “Well, I know they lost 3 “tough” MVFC games & finished 4th in the conference, but they are 8-3…so, yep, that’s our #5 seed.” Let a SoCon Team lose (only) to 3 tough SoCon Teams & see what seed they get - they won’t even get on the “Last 4 Out” list!

So…yeah…to have 5 Teams able to get a 1st round a playoff win, IF they could get a bid, is indicative of a strong FCS Conference. Getting a 2nd round win (without being seeded), is almost always an upset of a (theoretical) Top 8 Team on the road…after they’ve had a week of rest at a time when most Teams could use nothing more than a week to heal up. If no byes (say…a playoff field seeded 1-16 or 1-32) & neutral sites, I would say all 5 of these Teams COULD win a 2nd round game.

[apaladin]

Slight correction but ETSU was ranked 10th when they played UTC.

[FUBeAR]

Slight correction but ETSU was ranked 10th when they played UTC.

You’re correct …and the Bucs are 13th / 14th now … behind, in both polls, an MVFC Team & a Big Sky Team, both with 2 FCS losses to 5 wins & both sitting in 5th place in their Conferences.

So…9 Teams ahead of them (1 tied for 5th with 1 of them, but beat them H2H) in their own conferences…and they are ranked ahead of the SoCon Leading, 1 FCS loss & 1SEC win, 7-1 ETSU squad.

Ridiculous. ETSU should be ranked no lower than #7 right now and should have been no lower than #3 when they lost to Chatt.

[Furmanoid]

Slight correction but ETSU was ranked 10th when they played UTC.

You’re correct …and the Bucs are 13th / 14th now … behind, in both polls, an MVFC Team & a Big Sky Team, both with 2 FCS losses to 5 wins & both sitting in 5th place in their Conferences.

So…9 Teams ahead of them (1 tied for 5th with 1 of them, but beat them H2H) in their own conferences…and they are ranked ahead of the SoCon Leading, 1 FCS loss & 1SEC win, 7-1 ETSU squad.

Ridiculous. ETSU should be ranked no lower than #7 right now and should have been no lower than #3 when they lost to Chatt.

Montana, with a pretty good football history and a win against a top 20 FBS team is ranked a few spots ahead of ETSU, a team two eyelashes away from 3 SoCon losses. And last season’s FCS runner up (by 2 points like 6 months ago) is also ranked ahead of the ETSU. Of course they are. That isn’t unfair at all. If ETSU is better they will have a chance to prove it.

To get respect the SoCon needs for somebody to have a sustainable program that does something in the playoffs year after year. So when FU or somebody else beats them, it seems to mean something. ETSU beat Samford and Furman. WOW! Who cares?

The last team that did anything was WC awhile ago and they now stink. So how is anybody supposed to evaluate wins against SoCon comp?

[FUBeAR]

Slight correction but ETSU was ranked 10th when they played UTC.

You’re correct …and the Bucs are 13th / 14th now … behind, in both polls, an MVFC Team & a Big Sky Team, both with 2 FCS losses to 5 wins & both sitting in 5th place in their Conferences.

So…9 Teams ahead of them (1 tied for 5th with 1 of them, but beat them H2H) in their own conferences…and they are ranked ahead of the SoCon Leading, 1 FCS loss & 1SEC win, 7-1 ETSU squad.

Ridiculous. ETSU should be ranked no lower than #7 right now and should have been no lower than #3 when they lost to Chatt.

Montana, with a pretty good football history and a win against a top 20 FBS team is ranked a few spots ahead of ETSU, a team two eyelashes away from 3 SoCon losses. And last season’s FCS runner up (by 2 points like 6 months ago) is also ranked ahead of the ETSU. Of course they are. That isn’t unfair at all. If ETSU is better they will have a chance to prove it.

To get respect the SoCon needs for somebody to have a sustainable program that does something in the playoffs year after year. So when FU or somebody else beats them, it seems to mean something. ETSU beat Samford and Furman. WOW! Who cares?

The last team that did anything was WC awhile ago and they now stink. So how is anybody supposed to evaluate wins against SoCon comp?

pooh - ‘you’ lose 2 FCS games in THIS season (what rankings & playoff selections (are supposed to) assess) and ‘I’ve’ only lost 1 FCS game AND ‘you’ don’t have a better FBS win than ‘I’ do AND ‘you’ have 1 (Montana) or 2 (SDSU) fewer FCS wins than ‘I’ do AND 1 of ‘your’ fewer FCS wins than ‘mine’ is over 0-7 transitioning/playoff ineligible Dixie State (both Montana & SDSU), ‘you’ sure as heck-fire DO NOT deserve to be ranked ahead of ‘me.’

[Furmanoid]

But one of my losses was by 1 point in overtime against #3. Would you come that close to beating them? You needed OT to beat Samford. My other loss was to #16. You don’t play anybody and lost to a no name UT branch college. I’ve gone to the playoffs like 10 years in a row and came in 2nd six months ago. You’re ETSU. Give me a break.

Or I lost to #6 and #15 by one score. And one of those was on a freaking red field! But I beat FBS #20, not some DII team pretending to be an SEC team. Aside from those games, I stomp people. I don’t need a miracle to beat somebody like Furman. Oh, and I’ve been a playoff program forever. So you lose, sir! Good day, sir!